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Author Topic: mains pressure valve conversion problem  (Read 7140 times)

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Offline bentley

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mains pressure valve conversion problem
« on: September 17, 2010, 01:09:43 PM »
Hello,
I have a 180L electric mains pressure cylinder on the ground floor of my 2 storey house.  Unfortunately it is fitted with low pressure valve gear, with a vent that runs to the roof.  Pressure is poor, even with the valve mounted on the roof vent pipe.  I have asked my plumber whether mains pressure valve gear could be fitted.  I understand the problem is that there is nowhere for the TPR (?) - the small valve at the top of the cylinder that normally drains down the side of the cyclinder with an air gap - to drain to.  The cylinder is "landlocked" centrally in the house, with a concrete floor.  I understand the valve must drain down from the cylinder, and cannot go up inot the small gap between floors.  Has anyone resolved this sort of issue before, either with fancy valvegear, or successfully laying a pipe into a shallow groove cut into the concrete floor (covered in carpet in my case), or other?  Thanks for any suggestions.

Linkback: https://www.plumbers.nz/q-and-a-hot-water-cylinders/44/mains-pressure-valve-conversion-problem/512/

Offline Thunderhead

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Re: mains pressure valve conversion problem
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2010, 04:58:46 PM »
At a guess you have a 7.6meter pressure reducing valve feeding the cylinder?...and a 3.something relife valve on the roof...you can get a 12 meter head PRV(pressure reducing valve) and whack a 7.6meter relief valve on the roof...This will give you better pressure without the hassle of fully going mains. Not to sure if im 100% correct on this anyone else out there know any better???




Does the origional cylinder have a drain on it as by code....AS/NZS 3500.5 domestic installations....3.22.5 In New Zealand all storage water heaters in excess of 45L capacity shall be provided with a drain pipe valved and capped as appropriate....in saying that your cylinder i assume has a cylinder drain on it which as nessary can be up plugged and branched into to act as a TPR(trempature pressure relife valve) and CWEV(cold water expansion valve)...provided that the drain line is 20mm copper...15mm copper will be too small to allow both valves to work effectivley in case of emergency...In saying that it also depends on where the drain terminates...mate there are alot of possibilities to solving this problem using the codes...does one of the cubboard walls lead to the outside wall...possibility of raising the cylinder and then putting drain inside wall to outside building...also possibility of discharging to tun dish then having a fully glued 88 degree trap then chasing it in to the slab and falling it to the drain or relief gully out side the cwev will keep the trap charged...also raising the cylinder sitting it on a safe tray and discharging to the safe tray with required air gap and chassing in safe tray waste into the slab...
Mate theres alot of ways to solve your problem...the main way to solve your problem is to ring a plumber who has all the revelent codes and standards at his/her fingertips and is able to solve your problem as it dont sound like your standard problem that a home handy man can rip into...but it will cost money! have you had any thoughts of relocating your cylinder to another cupboard in your house to enable this drain line issue not to be an issue?....Good luck I hope this helps cheers

Offline Jaxcat

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Re: mains pressure valve conversion problem
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2010, 07:42:35 PM »
Or better still consider getting a continuous flow unit attached to the outside of your house and rip out the cylinder all together.  Powerco will give you up to the first 40m from the gas main to the house for free if you connect to NG in a Powerco region and you install water heating or central heating!
Have you learned lessons only of those who admired you, and were tender with you, and stood aside for you?  Have you not learned great lessons from those who braced themselves against you, and disputed the passage with you?  (Walt Whitman 1819-1891)  American Poet

Offline Thunderhead

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Re: mains pressure valve conversion problem
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2010, 11:26:15 PM »
na mate stick with the good old trusty electric cylinder as gas means a line rental and $1500 out lay for the unit and install costs and hassle of paying another bill...any cupboard backing on to a up stairs bathroom will do $300 mains valve kit...run waste out through joist space...easy peasy...lol...hey jax you can tell i dont do gas...push the electric...hahaha :P

Offline bentley

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Re: mains pressure valve conversion problem
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2010, 12:05:20 AM »
Thanks for the quick reply guys. Answer for Thunderhead:
Yes, a newish Apex PRV with a yellow 7.6 tag attached, and some sort of valve attached to a wrapped "hockey stick" shaped roof vent.  The cylinder is raised 800mm on a bench, and isolated in the middle of the house under the stairs, and there is no handy wall leading to the outside into which a drain line could be concealed.  The house was built and presuambly plumbed in 1985 (Ive only had it couple yrs).  

The cylinder has no drain I can see, just the normal single pipe with valves coming in the bottom, a central pipe out the top presumably feeding the bathroom taps, and a third pipe out the top, near the edge of the cylinder, going up to the roof vent. However, there is a short tee of copper pipe branching off the inlet pipe just before the cylinder- it ends in a closed ball valve dangling in mid air. This presumably acts as a drain line if needed.  All pipe work is 15mm.

You're right, I didnt expect to do it myself, it just seemed a bit frustrating to have to rip out a perfectly good 9yr old cylinder and maybe install something like Jaxcats exterior continuous flow unit (which would still have its own siting and connection issues), simply because of an apparently trivial (to the lay person) detail as not having a drain destination for the occasional drip of vent water.

Again you are spot on, yes, there is a 135L gas Rheem cylinder on the second floor that serves the upstairs bathrooms (A bit small to serve all of this fairly big house) which could be upgraded, and this electric cylinder ditched, assuming the plumber could track all the pipework and reconnect without destroying all my walls! Perhaps that would be best. Anyway, you answered my question in that yes it appears it is possible to chase a drain into the concrete floor, if a suitable wall isn't handy.  I had thought this might have been a no-no.

cheers,


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