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Author Topic: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate  (Read 5899 times)

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Offline Enn

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ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« on: February 03, 2012, 02:59:44 PM »
I am interested if anyone knows what is happening here?
 I seem to be one of the apprentices of the 2008 - 2011 uptake that has been drawn into the MIT screw up, what ever that exactly was.
I have heard that some apprentices that have left NZ and now working in Australia will be called back to complete some improperly delivered unit standards.

 I have rang NZQA, The Board and the ITO. my block course provider  and talked to my Regional Training Advisor.
 my supervisor also rang the ITO to speak to the CEO and said he was fobbed off.... no mean feat i assure you!

I passed my Plumbing & Gasfitting Registration exams in June 2011.
Completed my last block course in July 2011.
requested a copy  of my Record Of Achievement from NZQA which i received december 2011.

The most annoying aspect of this is the lack of communication. after all that effort, the tangible results of ataining Registration is hanging in bureaucratic limbo.
Im hoping that this will not affect the time frame for eligibility to achieve Certifying status.
Pay rise...... yeah Right
Don't speak to me of competency!











Linkback: https://www.plumbers.nz/rant-or-rave/5/ito-nzqa-audit-national-certificate/977/
''Never have so many been fooled by so few''
Plumbing is not a career it is a disease....

Offline Thunderhead

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2012, 10:33:49 PM »
hi guys,what the hell is coming through this site at the moment hope we don`t get a visit from the police,!!!!!


another post from the board...This must be a list of there CASE LAW files...lololol

Offline Jaxcat

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2012, 07:20:12 AM »
Enn - you are fine.  If you have received your National Certificate all should be ok.  Currently there are a number of Version 3 apprentices who attended final block courses from August on who have not yet received their national certificates.  After the complaint about MIT NZQA informed the ITO that they were not allowed to issue any unit standards until NZQA had looked over the assessment materials.  This spread from MIT to all the polytec's.  The ITO and NZQA have been battling it out since last year - the communication to trainees and employers has been disgusting and it is still not resolved.  Learning providers appear not to have done what was required of them administratively to record assessments, and perhaps in some cases some trainees may need to return to the tech to complete some assessments.  The point is NO ONE knows - it is frustrating,unsettling, and a total piss off.

I see you were fobbed off - no surprise there then.  These people have little concept of "customer satisfaction".  NZQA are doing their job - ensuring that the qualifications remain solid - that there are no dodgy shortcuts being taken, and that when it says you are competent in a unit standard, then you are competent.  The only way they have of knowing this is a paper trail.  What has the ITO been doing?  Well they have some pretty fast and slick answers - non of which has assisted the people involved in understanding any better WHEN they will either be called back to tech, required to do some on site work verification, or indeed received their much needed National Certificate.

I encourage both you and your employer, and any others effected out there to write to Mr Trevor Helm, the ITO Board Chair - and express their dissatisfaction with the lack of communication, the apparent ineptness and continue to put pressure on them to tell us what the hell is going on.
Have you learned lessons only of those who admired you, and were tender with you, and stood aside for you?  Have you not learned great lessons from those who braced themselves against you, and disputed the passage with you?  (Walt Whitman 1819-1891)  American Poet

Offline Thunderhead

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2012, 12:06:54 PM »
i did my last block course at the unitech in august last year it took untill early december(with me hassling them)to get my results sent to NZQA then i sent the check in to get my award printed out...one week later i recieved a reciept from the NZQA saying that my certificate would be sent, soon another week passed and i got a letter in the post from the NZQA stating that they would not give me my cert because i had standard units missing from my results sent from the unitech!....immediatley i thought how can you take my money without FIRST checking to see if i am ellegable to recieve what i had requested...they should have posted my check back to me and stated why they were unable to complete my request...instead the first thing they did was to cash the check then later inform me as to why i couldnt get my certificate..lol...apparently the request first goes to the accounts devision then after they have taken the money it gets passed on to other areas to check if everything is ok...Wouldnt it be wonderful to be payed for a job first only to tell the owner after looking at the job that it cant be done because of so and so...lol
Anyways after back and forth with the unitech and the NZQA i found that the unitech had failed to correctly file all of my results with the NZQA...and finally i was awared my national cert in plumbing after a few butt clenching weeks due to what was happening to my mate at mit who had to go back and attend courses again even after he had done every ounce of bookwork they gave him........And this is where my point is i believe the trouble happned when the apprenticeship tranning trust switched providers from the unitech to the MIT...BECAUSE there is no formal traning docturine between the diffrent traning providers students are trained diffrent things at diffrent times making it almopst immpossible to switch between training providers if one feels unhappy with there current traning proider...there should be a set nationwide traning curriculum between the diffrent providers enabling students to switch or if they move town/city they can still continue there studies uninterupted....
For example
I started at the MIT in hamiliton and in my first block course we were shown how to rate gas applinces...after that year i transffred up to auckland unitech...in my 3rd year at unitech i was shown how to rate gas applinces again...so im sure i missed on something in my traning because they teach diffrent things at diffrent times at diffrent traning providers when they should ALL work to a yearly unit standard programe set out by the ito so if a student does switch then it will be a seemless switch...plain and simple logical thinking!.
And this would work wonders for all employees out there because you would know exactly what knowledge your apprentise had(or should have) at any given stage from year one to year 4 so you could best know where to place that employee to suit there current progress.

Offline Enn

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2012, 06:24:50 PM »
Jaxcat, it is the National Certificate im waiting for , the Record Of Achievement i ordered free off the NZQA website.
 Hoping to apply for my registration with the R.O.A from NZQA , apparently this is not appropriate for the board I need the National Certificate.
So I await with baited breath.


Offline Jaxcat

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2012, 06:33:51 PM »
Yes the PGDB will not register you without your National Certificate.  When did you do your last block course?  If it was August on then you will be caught up in the NZQA/ITO to-ing and fr-oing that is going on at present.  It affects MIT, Weltec trainees definitely, and possibly Wintec, SIT and other polytecs - although I cannot confirm any other than MIT and Weltec.  I know NZQA is demanding information from the ITO - once they are provided with all of this they will assess it and make a decision about whether apprentices need to undertake more training at the polytech or not.  It may be you have to go and re-do a couple of things, you may be orally tested and then your employer confirm worksite verification of competency.  If you completed your last block course before August 2011 then it is my understanding that you should have no reason why you haven't received your National Certificate providing all the results were sent.  Ring the ITO on Tuesday and see what they say. Your employer should be assisting you with this.  Basically I wouldn't think you would want to go from trainee status to registered/licensed status before April or you will effectively pay twice in a period of only a few months.

I would be happy to answer any other questions - I have a number of apprentices currently and am constantly chasing up information about what is going on.
You can ring NZQA and ask for Tim Fowler (Deputy Chief Executive of NZQA) - he is working on the issue, or alternatively if you feel you are not getting anywhere with ITO staff, then check out their website and start contacting their Board members.  Mr Trevor Helm is the chair.  His email address is on the website.  Be polite and clear about the questions you want answered - even if it is simply WHEN am I getting my National Certificate.  Wal Gordon of the Federation has asked apprentices to feed back their experiences with training and the ITO for the next newsletter.  You can contact him through the Fellow Practitioner part of the website.

Offline Enn

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2012, 10:08:46 PM »
Well I did my stage 3 at CPIT 20th june Just after the examinations.
 I was one of the last version 3 lot that no transition time was allowed for when they rolled over to the new version,and had less than the 48 months apprenticeship.

I understand that I have a contract with the ITO called a Training Agreement and I have paid in full........

Thanks Jaxcat for shedding a light on whats  going on here it is appreciated.
I will be making a few calls.

Offline Jaxcat

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2012, 10:14:59 PM »
Did you make any phone calls today Enn?  And if so how did you get on? 

Offline Enn

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2012, 10:24:11 PM »
Well my boss rang the NZQA Mr Fowler & ITO board member Mr Helms and left a message and contact details.
We await their response.

Back in the trenches tomorrow....

Offline Enn

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2012, 10:54:03 PM »
Well good news  basically I should receive a letter from the ITO explaining whats been going on  in a few days and my National Certificate next week. It was noted the tardy communication from the ITO.
 Also only 6 guys on my block course at CPIT  will have to Have their employers confirm competency on some on the job stuff.
There was a lot more stuff said but that's the guts of it.

Needless to say I will be applying for my registration next licencing period.

Offline Jaxcat

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2012, 05:47:22 AM »
Great to hear - did Mr Helm contact your boss?  Or did the CEO come back with the information.  I'm picking there's some heated discussions going on behind closed doors there.  Bottom line is service is lacking from our ITO and their Board have been very silent on the subject.  Glad that you will be getting your National Certificate shortly - and should be all good to go come 1 April to get licensed.  Congratulations and well done.

Offline Enn

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2012, 08:27:13 PM »
Well Mr Helms got in contact with my boss and was very helpfull  and understood  the issues as he is an employer himself.
We were unable to talk to NZQA Mr Tim Fowler as he was in a meeting , however his Executive Assistant explained everything very well and acknowledged that the timeframe was excessive.
So there we have it.

Rant over.......

Offline aboutgas

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2012, 09:32:12 PM »
Well Mr Helms got in contact with my boss and was very helpfull  and understood  the issues as he is an employer himself.
We were unable to talk to NZQA Mr Tim Fowler as he was in a meeting , however his Executive Assistant explained everything very well and acknowledged that the timeframe was excessive.
So there we have it.

Rant over.......

Hi Enn

Have you asked them for some sort of compensation from them in regards to the longer waiting time you have had to endure and the fact that it has potentially harmed your career opportunity's I:E you might just have been looking for a new job as a Licenced practitioner or that your payrise has been held up due to their incompetence.

The more it hurts there hip pocket the sooner they might just get there shit together
Unless the moral improves the floggings will continue

Offline Jaxcat

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2012, 10:51:41 PM »
Well it was heartening to hear that Mr Helm was helpful to your boss.  It restores some of my faith in the ITO Board.  However, the questions must be asked - is Mr Helm going to contact every employer?  Because at the moment there are a number of them in the dark, not to mention the actual apprentices themselves.  Where is the leadership and direction.  I understand the conflict the ITO Board has between governance and management - but they cannot hide behind that forever.  The Board set the direction, they set the policies, they set the budgets.  They also set the KPI's for the CEO. Presumably the CEO is their only employee - and then the CEO employs the remainder - so they have only one employee to manage in essence.  How did we end up in the mess?  Where did it all start to go wrong?  I would say faith in the training system is at an all time low - there are not too many people from apprentices, to employers, to tutors and all those in between who would stand up at the moment and say the training system we have now is in A1 shape. 

Who's to blame?  And more importantly - how is it going to be put right?

Offline Enn

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Re: ITO NZQA audit- National Certificate
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2012, 12:08:07 PM »
Ah well, good news I received my national certificates today in the post so all is good .
 I look foward to registration for the coming year. Glad thats done and dusted.



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