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hi guys, an offer by Mico Wakefield AKA Fletchers, free upskilling for 16 points, apparently the Master Plumbers called them and complained about it but it is still on. If you are able to attend give them a call, unfortunately i will be in Aussie on holiday otherwise i would not miss it, cheers
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hi guys, forgot to mention it is in Christchurch, as an aside it may pay for anyone outside ch-ch to make the effort to travel in,cheers
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Are you sure you have that right Robbo? Why would anyone complain about upskilling, let alone free upskilling worth 16 points? Sometimes the old tom tom drums can distort the message. Seems a great opportunity to me - and good to see it in Christchurch where you guys have had enought grief on your plates to date, and at least you can save a few dollars.
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hi guys/jax, the info i was given was from the manager at Micos,cheers
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I am speechless then.
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My boss in auck did the free mico courses a fortnight ago in auckland and he got 14 points from it and still seeks two points...non technical...
He went and did not learn a thing he reckoned and after 30 odd years in the trade i can understand this...but he did enjoy the free beers and having a chat with other plumbers.
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apparently the Master Plumbers called them and complained about it but it is still on.
LMAO - different story when the shoes on the other foot hey?!?
Master plumbers have paved the way for this corporate barrow pushing crap, maybe a few more of these to take the coin of MP will finally set them straight - yeah right! sounds like one of those tui billboards, we can only but live in hope!
I would also not hesitate to speculate that in doing this "FREE" upskill course that there will be some form of remuneration to Mico's and/or whatever "SPONSOR" it is based around...
anymore details on the course content thunderhead?
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Any supplier offering free courses at the moment is doing industry a bit of a favour. The whole regime will be up for debate in the next few weeks when the PGDB's consultation document comes out. This is the time to have your say about what you think. In the meantime we have to play the game and collect points. Merchants will always try to assist their customers - and in this way they are assisting themselves - I have no problem
with that - it's business plain and simple. The problem is that the current system is a debacle and is making practitioners "points whores" - heads are swayed by points rather than the quest for knowledge - sort of backfiring on what the entire idea was really. A number of the "courses" are sales pitches - no more, no less - and they have been approved by the PGDB. They are the gate keepers in all of this and we the mere puppets.
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Free courses are bloody great. I like to upskill but I'll never pay a cent to master plumbers for what should be free.
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Yes free gets the attention! thanks for the heads up.
I will copy the flyer and pass it around the local merchants CPD courses pretty thin on the ground round these parts.
Between the recession and acc who needs the board breathing down yer neck......
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Any supplier offering free courses at the moment is doing industry a bit of a favour. The whole regime will be up for debate in the next few weeks when the PGDB's consultation document comes out. This is the time to have your say about what you think. In the meantime we have to play the game and collect points. Merchants will always try to assist their customers - and in this way they are assisting themselves - I have no problem
with that - it's business plain and simple. The problem is that the current system is a debacle and is making practitioners "points whores" - heads are swayed by points rather than the quest for knowledge - sort of backfiring on what the entire idea was really. A number of the "courses" are sales pitches - no more, no less - and they have been approved by the PGDB. They are the gate keepers in all of this and we the mere puppets.
jax I dont buy into this mind-set - I hear where ya coming from but the industry should never have reached this stage in the first place
for a supplier to have any form of control or influence over the licensing of practitioners is both immoral and unethical - and in my humble opinion bordering criminal -
for the record I have nothing against upskilling - I just believe that it should NOT be in the hands of people that are no more than sales reps
give them an inch - they WILL take a mile
how far do we open the gate??
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Integrated - I am on the same page as you - BUT until the system is changed then we have to work within it. It is, as I have said previously, a debacle. The thing is geared towards gaining "points" not knowledge. At this stage I think we give the consultation, when it comes out in the next three weeks, our best shot and make our opinions heard loud and clear - and then wait to see what the PGDB come up with. Mr Bickers (PGDB Chair) has promised a decision prior to Christmas on the future of Competency Based Licensing. Let's hope it is a sensible one that works for all.
The way to keep control of the situation with suppliers is to use your $$$$ and spend them with suppliers who are not insisting on charging an arm and a leg for upskilling courses, after all is it not a reward for customer loyalty that they would offer you upskilling courses at no additional cost.
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I dont know of any suppliers who are charging for courses. The only ones charging for courses are the Master Baters. Its just a money making scheme for them. How dare they try and stop Micos from running free courses! Just shows they dont really give a stuff about plumbers out there, they only care about their bank accounts.
As I said in an earlier thread, the Master Plumbers stopped me from going to a seminar they organised where a council inspector was giving a speech on how they interpret the building code last year. You'd think the Master Baters would welcome qualified tradesmen into these seminars to show them what they have to offer and try and upskill the whole trade, but no. Its all about money.
This whole thing has made me so determined to never pay for CPD!
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Hi guys, yes jax I agree the free courses are good for the industry, as for the up skilling in the hands of reps! Who cares? Anyone can teach you how to keep safe while working in the sun, It just goes to prove that if one group try`s to corner the market to set up a money making scheme, another group will want a slice of the action and so sets up in opposition, the bottom line is that master plumbers have got nothing to sell so they lobby the board to make rules to favour their scheme, well it hasn’t worked. I agree with integrated that the industry should never have reached this stage; it will be interesting to see where it all finishes up, cheers,
p.s. I believe mico`s have pulled out of sponsorship with m.p`s
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The way i look at it is the only people that should be able to hold up skilling courses are the training instutions and the only bloody thing you should be upskilled on is the bloody codes! and anmendents to the current codes...no body should have product upskilling courses as these are a have and are not real courses...if i want to use a new product then i ring the company selling it and arrange a meeting with the rep to give me the low down on the product...otherwise i read the bloody instaliation details....the ONLY thing that they lawfully could say we need up skilling in is the codes and codes only!
"anymore details on the course content thunderhead?"
Not to sure will ask boss tomorrow but he said it was easy as pie with stuff lined up on a wall and you go along and fill in the blank spaces sort of thing...but one thing he noted was that the pancones they had wernt sealing correctly and rearly only suited a "s" hook up otherwise to strip the pancone and silicone seal the horn rubber in and out to stop leaking when hooked up in a "p" style...otherwise he didnt learn anything new but got free points which is what he was after.....
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I don't think that upskilling is a bad thing at all - but there is a demarcation between the sort of thing you should need to do to keep a practising licence, and the sort of personal upskilling you might do out of interest, or to learn about new products at the merchants etc. Master Plumber members agree to do continued professional development as part of our membership - no problems with that you have a choice. Also remember that Master Plumbers were asked by their members to provide courses so they could obtain points - no problem with that - and no different to AA members getting AA rewards - it is after all a membership based organisation and there for the benefit of members. I agree that non-members should be charged a differential - otherwise why would members pay a membership fee if everyone got everything they got. It is not Master Plumbers issue that the Board introduced a points based scheme - that decision belongs to the PGDB alone.
In an ideal world I believe the following should apply to Competency Based Licensing (which is different to continued professional development):
Mandatory courses for all practitioners around Codes and Legislation as soon as there is a change - with a 12 month window of opportunity to undertake either a face to face course, or perhaps an on line course.
The Board may decide from time to time to make some courses mandatory based on evidence they gather through disciplinary action over a 12 month period i.e. if they start to see a lot of issues around LPG installations I would accept that they make an LPG course mandatory for all. This would clearly DEMONSTRATE A NEED and also meets the criteria of protecting the health and safety of the public. Like wise with plumbing or drainage issues - where they pull information from disciplinary hearings they could put this before the trades and then necessitate a course around it. (Disciplinary action = cases against practitioners) - as opposed to prosecutions through the court for members of the public who try to practise plumbing, gasfitting and drainlaying. In addition to this people could keep their own "learning log" for professional reading, product upskilling, and any other pertinent courses and send this in with their licence application. This would give the Board a basis to select people for audit along with other criteria they may set down. Mandatory courses would need to be economic and not impose undue costs - and given the numbers this should be relatively easy to enforce.
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hi guys/jax, you say...It is not Master Plumbers issue that the Board introduced a points based scheme - that decision belongs to the PGDB alone.
But did the m.ps. with their influence ,c.e.o./chairman/board members, drive the decision which the board then introduced,cheers
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Hi Robbo
did the m.ps. with their influence ,c.e.o./chairman/board members, drive the decision which the board then introduced,cheers
It would certainly seem so after the government decision regarding the regulation review comity recommendation. As the dis-honarable minister has openly stated he was lobbied by masterbaters and suppliers who were probably under pressure from the very same masterbaters who caused the problem in the first place.
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It is interesting that in the 2006 regs , the board has the option of directing plumbers gasfitters or drainlayers to attend courses where they see a need ,
Then we have a new regulation requiring all boats caravans mobile homes etc gasfitting to be carried out by licenced gasfitters . This would be an instance where the board should direct those who are unfamiliar with this type of work to upskill if they want to be involved , We have a standard, but I am sure we could learn a lot of the main things to be aware of, with a well run expereinced person runing a course . Maybe even a document as they have done with IPI systems , and lpg installations .
I did attend a 2 hour course here , but to be honest dont feel confident , especially with existing installations , there are so many variables particlarly with boats , at this stage I will refrain from this type of work , The public will not be happy if most gasfitters do the same , which I'm hearing.