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What do you think? ???
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The heating industry should be treated as a stand alone trade and no different to gasfitting or refrigeration trades etc. believe it or not some of us out here are proper qualified heating engineers. However I do think some kind of registration or upskilling etc should be done
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Hi there,
underfloor heating is a very serious thing, if you stuff it up you really stuffed it up. Being a registered plumber does not mean he is able putting it in properly it just means "nothing". leave it up to a Heating Engineer. To do it properly anyway you have to get a heatloss calculation done to make sure you get the right amount of pipes in the slab. There is no rule of thumb to size any underfloor heating, every house is different (location, size, windows, etc.). Anybody, regardless if registered or not, who touches underfloor heating and does not know what he is doing will disapoint the customer only and he will pay for the stuff up.
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Most plumbers in NZ just dont understand heating let alone gas so it would be poor if they were registered by this crap pgdb, the question should be do we want to pay more fees to this stupid plumbers board. better still lets get rid of the pgdb because they dont understand about gas and gas safety NEWZEALAND NEEDS A GAS SAFETY POLICY THAT WORKS AND DOESNT COST US GAS ENGINEERS FROM ENGLAND ANYTHING AS WE WERE TRAINED IN GAS SAFETY
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Beware of change as it will only cost you money and possibly your freedom.
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Under Floor heating system
Under floor heating as was mentioned by Fedel64 is not as simple as it seems. It involves a lot of calculations if one is to get it working perfectly.
For any one out there who would like to know how an under floor heating system can be designed and where one can get the state of the art Materials and design Information. Please contact the, Uponor Company, their Website is uponor.de
They have an under floor heating design manual under the title of Polycomfort Die Fußbodenheizung mit 5-Sterne-Komfort. Which in English means, Polycomfort the under floor heating system with 5 star Comfort. Try finding out from them if they have an English version of the same. In case they don’t I can help with the German to English translation but at a Cost.
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NO NO NO it should only be done by heating engineers do we have any?
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What do you think? ???
I think yes, or registered gasfitters. Unlike JD - I have a lot of faith in the NZ training system and NZ plumbers. We need to keep as much in this industry regulated as we can - or we gradually lose things to others that are not regulated. Backflow testing is a glaring example of what has happened when we don't keep these things to regulated trades.
NZ plumbers and gasfitters are much sought after the world over if they have completed a proper apprenticeship. I have had four of my staff do their OE inthe last couple of years and all of them have been snapped up in the UK. I have also had feedback from their employers over there and it has been glowing - they are reliable, well trained and capable of a wide range of things - they work in well with other trades and want to assist to move the job forward. JD - I think it is sad that you have such a low opinion of NZ gasfitters. I believe our tradesmen are amongst the best in the world. We do things differently and what I do think NZ lacks is a number of gas appliance servicepeople. This is an area where our older staff are now retiring and without the large gas companies who used to train them, no one appears to be putting in the time and effort to do so.
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hi guys, most heating systems are designed by engineers who draw up plans. If plans are followed properly i am sure that plumbers could install them with no problems, but if it is a mild steel piping system you would need certified welders to install generally "fitter welders" are employed who will have to prove thier welding ability, it is not plumbing!cheers
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hi there,
don't let any plumber or gas fitter touch any heating system at all. this trade is made for heating engineers and not for the rest of any trade, so keep out of it. 25 years ago the germans have stuffed the underfloor heating systems up in Germany and they have learned from their mistakes but the Kiwi's just don't listen and just don't like to learn what they stuff up. If an underfloor heating is not installed properly it does not work. There is no changing afterwards there is no second shot.
We at Warmtec we have a 100% money back guarantee on fully working underfloor heating systems. We calculate and model every system. If you need any help in your calculations, please feel free to get in contact with us.
And by the way in which century did you get stuck with your steel pipes in the floor, that sort of system is not being put in for the last 30-35 years. We use pipes up to 1000m on a coil, reduces installation costs and waste. I cannot imagine anybody buying any underfloor heating system of you.
cheers
Fidl
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i dont think underfloor heating would be that hard as long as one knows what calucations to apply. flow/return/heatloss/enviromental conditions/thermial conductivity of material used etc etc...as a plumber it would be a nice add on to my license to have say an underfloor heating endorsment...but without any formal training i wouldnt even try to design a system but with an engenerred plan installing these systems would be a pieace of cake for plumbers in fact any monkey with half a brain could do it after all if you know how to read plans then a underfloor heating plan shouldnt be hard to follow!
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Hi there,
you are right it lays in the calculation and that's the key and everything. Without knowing how a building performes and that takes quite a bit to understand nobody should touch it.
Putting the pipes down, you are right there as well, you can use monkeys but to do the design that's where you need the know how and if you stuff it up you have ripped the customer of and that is not right.
It looks like you are just out for an other medal that you can add on to your plumbing certificate. Why don't you understand, you guys, stick to the stuff you understand and leave the rest to the expert.
cheers
Fidl
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Hi Thunderhead,
if you think of doing anything with underfloor heating, let me know and I will try to upskill you as good as I can so you can do the job properly.
You have to understand I cannot pass all my knowledge, that I have collected, trained and studied over the last 30 years, in just a few hours.
cheers Fidl
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Hi Fidl thanks for the offer i might take you up on it...one thing i know is if your going to do a job then do it properly cus at the end of the day that work will reflect on you.
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Underfloor heating is not rocket science, the perameters for calculating efficient installation is not hard, a competent nz qualified tradesman, installing any of the reputable systems is far better than some jonny waving a certiciate they got in a correspondence course back in there homeland, I have seen and do see so called experts coming to NZ and harping on about how clever they are and then once you see them in action it is instantly apparent that they aint so clever. Dont get me wrong, a good heat engineer, or gasfitter is worth his salt irregardless of their country of origin and with our collapsing training systems being taken over by non trade proffesionals, government officials, and businessmen focussed on making a buck or futher enhancing their position. We too have numb nuts trained here parading as tradesmen and that is probably the biggest risk
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What do you think? ???
No