Plumbers NZ is New Zealand's largest online plumbing, gas and drainage resource. Plumbing exam help, plumbing news, directory and free quotes.
-
hi guys, still 10 days left in the month but it`s out already,
... Fit and proper person policy. This policy was approved by the Board on 26 March 2013. (no consultation needed obviously)
The board has now put a fit and proper person policy in place to guide the Board’s approach to the fit and proper person requirement under section 36, 44 and 51 of the Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers Act. This requirement affects people applying to be registered in the licensed class and will not affect tradespeople renewing their existing licences or applying to be registered in the certifying class. It means that someone applying to be registered in the licensed class must satisfy the Board that they are a fit and proper person. A fit and proper person is someone who is suitable to be registered in the licensed class as a plumber, gasfitter, or drainlayer. When someone applies to the Board to be registered in the licensed class they will now be asked questions about their character and health to identify any issues that may impact on their ability to work in the trade they are applying for registration in.
...
looks like a can of worms to me, if they don`t like you! you are out, but it you have mates in game you are in: I would have thought to be a`Fit and proper person`you are someone who has served an apprenticeship and passed the prescribed exams, cheers
-
What the hell? Is this Board progressing from being the plumbing police to being the Social Standards Police?
What next, will they be policing people going to public toilets to ensure they are fit and proper.
I've got a size ten boot which I'd like to fit in a proper place.
-
what a joke! >:(
-
Lucky that they don't apply this policy to themselves - because at the moment you have several people sitting around a table who have taken money illegally from the whole of industry. In other circles I think they call these people thieves, or fraudsters. Fit and proper? Not in my book.
-
hi guys, how is it that they took just about 3 months to tell us about it, cheers
-
this sounds like a human rights commission issue here, I'm flabbergasted.
What next.........
-
Why did it take three months. Simple, they are trying to stretch out there work to make it look like they are doing something.
I wonder what the Justice Department will have to say about it - after all they are training inmates to be plumbers to give them a fresh start after they have done their sentences.
-
They are disgusting hypocrites, this is getting beyond, I got two words for them one begins with a EFF and the other ends in EFF, and they can do it right off.......
Can we get the parameters of the criteria to be a fit and proper.....because I would love to hold a mirror up to these morons...
-
Where's Bickers then....he on another holiday? I notice we got Marty Feldman again....unbelievable
I am gobsmacked........from their document see link below......
http://www.pgdb.co.nz/~downloads/Fit%20and%20proper%20person%20policy%20FINAL%20version%20approved%20by%20Board%2027%20March%202013.pdf
Such information may include, but is not limited to, conviction records from New Zealand or another country; or compliance information relating to sanitary
plumbing, gasfitting, or drainlaying.
There you go black and white....they can ask you anything....then refuse you a license......
-
Hi guys, if a company wants to employ an additional apprentice, and after doing a pre-trade course meets with the employer who agrees to take him on, does he then have to present his prospective new employee to the board for approval? It certainly reads like that may happen and could be a lengthy process as the board only meet a few times per year, cheers
-
These policies assist the Board to ensure that fair, reasonable, transparent and consistent decisions are made by the Board. hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
When someone applies to the Board to be registered in the licensed class they will now be asked questions about their character and health WTF.......my health???? they are medical examiners now......
People applying to be licensed or to renew a license are usually automatically accepted as fit and proper persons for the purpose of licensing.
Set up to take you out...........wankers.
-
Has he gone off half cocked again like his last release that he did, skiteing about how right he was.........then he was wrong.
-
Hi guys, this sounds a bit contradictive as the original statement says: (This requirement affects people applying to be registered in the licensed class and will not affect tradespeople renewing their existing licences) then another statement says (the Board decides whether it is satisfied that the applicant is a fit and proper person to be or remain licensed)this means that you are already licenced, so what is the truth, looks like we may need a lawyer to make a ruling, cheers
-
When someone applies to the Board to be registered in the licensed class they will now be asked questions about their character and health to identify any issues that may impact on their ability to work
On what planet are these clowns entitled to pass judgment on my health?
I am outraged, they have written a licence to take out anyone they see fit.....or unfit......just on their opinion.
What qualifications do they posses to do this......
Are you going to let this ride.......thin end of the wedge.............
-
I am angry now......so you have a car accident and loose a leg.......then these clowns take your licence off you.....
What happened to privacy, my doctor can't repeat my medical history, but these clowns can bully you into divulging your personal health history......on threat of taking your livelihood off you?
This is one step too far, I know and have experienced these people at their worst.............will they abuse this power?
My past experience tells me that it is almost a certainty...... >:(
-
I'll tell what the response is from Dr Max MD........
Max,
Under an Official Information Act request.
Please can you tell me as owner of the “fit and proper” policy and the decision maker of licensing….what are your qualifications to judge an applicants health, do you have any medical qualifications?
What health issues would render an applicant unfit based solely on health? What are the parameters that you would base an opinion on?
-
hi guys, what do you think Maurice thinks about it? did he o.k. it? cheers
-
So Mr Jackson if......in the info brief
This requirement affects people applying to be registered in the licensed class and will not affect tradespeople renewing their existing licences or applying to be registered in the certifying class.
Why is this hidden in the policy.........
4 Guiding principles
4.1 An applicant must satisfy the Board they are a fit and proper person to be entitled to:
a be registered under section 36 of the Act
b be issued with a practising licence under section 44 of the Act
c a renewal of their practising licence under section 51 of the Act.
-
Hi Guys
ADMINISTRATIVE PROVISIONS
7 Owner
7.1 The owner of this policy is the Registrar. Please refer any suggested amendments or errors to the owner.
Don't you think this is a bit "short" sighted of the registrar LOL
-
Now this is just wrong :o
Examinations policy
Updates to the examinations policy affect people who want to apply to sit examinations after 1 September 2014. Currently examination candidates for examinations 9192 licensed plumber, 9193 licensed gasfitter and 9197 licensed drainlayer must be enrolled to complete or have already completed their national certificate for the trade they applying to sit their registration examination in. From 1 September 2014 a person will be required to have completed their national certificate in order to be eligible to sit these examinations.
This is just another block in the way of apprentices.
How many of you guys sat and passed your exams before you finished your national certificate?
This is just designed to keep us oppressed as long as possible as labourers
-
hahaha short sighted....he should go gnome and review it, will this help the elf and safety of the public?
-
Just when you think we have run out of things to take the piss, they do something like this......got to be fair they are givers.....
-
FYI........section 50 and 51 of the Act.......
(a) renew the licence for the period (not exceeding 5 years)
The Board has the power to grant licenses for 5 years.....and at the costs imposed on us, they bloody should....or perhaps they want another trip to Melbourne, with their partners, this Christmas......while I work hard to try and give my kids a few presents........tossers.
50 Applications for renewal of practising licence
(1) An application for the renewal of a practising licence under
this subpart—
(a) must not be made earlier than 3 months before the licence’s
date of expiry; and
(b) must be sent or delivered to either—
(i) the Registrar; or
(ii) the Electrical Workers Registration Board if the
application is to be considered by that Board
under section 61; and
(c) must be in the form required by the Board; and
(d) must contain, or be accompanied by, the information
and documentation required by the Board; and
(e) must be accompanied by the prescribed fee (if any).
(2) The Registrar must refer any application received by the
Registrar under this section to the Board for consideration
under section 51.
(3) If an application for the renewal of a practising licence is made
before the licence’s date of expiry but the licence has not been
renewed before that date, the licence continues in force until
the application is determined.
51 Renewal of practising licence
(1) A registered person is entitled to a renewal of his or her practising
licence if the Board is satisfied that—
(a) the person has complied with the application requirements
in section 50; and
38
Reprinted as at
5 December 2012
Plumbers, Gasfitters, and Drainlayers
Act 2006 Part 2 s 51
(b) the person complies with the current applicable minimum
standards for registration; and
(c) there is no reason to believe that the person has breached
any term or condition of the licence during the period
before the licence is renewed; and
(d) the person is a fit and proper person to hold a practising
licence; and
(e) the person has satisfied the requirements of a competence
programme that the person is required to complete
under subsection (5).
(2) If the Board is satisfied that the registered person is entitled
to a renewal of his or her practising licence, the Board must
direct the Registrar to—
(a) renew the licence for the period (not exceeding 5 years)
that the Board thinks fit; and
(b) send to the person notification of the Board’s decision;
and
(c) enter details of the renewal in the register.
(3) If the Board is not satisfied that the registered person is entitled
to a renewal of his or her practising licence, the Board must
notify the person of—
(a) the Board’s decision; and
(b) the person’s right of appeal to a District Court against
the decision.
(4) For the purposes of subsection (1)(c), the Board may, if it
thinks fit, disregard a breach of a term or condition of the practising
licence.
(5) The Board may require a registered person to complete a competence
programme before it renews that person’s practising
licence (regardless of whether or not the Board is satisfied of
the matters referred to in subsection (1)(a) to (d)) if the person
is required to complete a competence programme when applying
for a renewal of the licence in accordance with a condition
or requirement imposed by a notice published under section
30.
(6) Despite subsection (1), if any fee or other money payable to
the Board under this Act by the registered person has not been
paid, the Board may refuse to renew that person’s practising
licence until that fee or other money is paid.
39
-
Right, next year I am going to go for a five year license....and cut some of the costs by a fifth......some of the costs
-
when is the spaceship landing to take the misfits back to their liar.
this is extraordinary.
you couldn't make this shit up to write a best seller, but i may just try as I'm just bout through with these clowns.
i met a guy recently who decided not to renew license, he had other income stream.
If what he said is correct and i have no reason to doubt he was contacted by the board as to why he was not re licensing. He said he was toldwhen asked if he was ever likely to re license not to leave it to long to relines in the future or the board may well feel compelled to audit his work from previous years..
-
So now to do plumbing, crawl through shit under houses and clear blocked drains of crap..... we are going to do an annual audit (if they get what they want), CPD which is illegal, pass a medical check, a police check......what are we joining the CIA?
All on Max's say so and opinion......if you don't provide the info to their intrusive questions.....no license......making you a criminal just for working......we are people who want to contribute and work, building this country.......not dole bludgers for Christ sake......
I used to be a commercial diver and my annual medical was $400, my mate just told me a pilots medical costs nearer $700 now a days....or is Dr Max MD going to do the health checks.....WTF. We don't earn enough to cover this bullshit.
When did this great career become so bloody complex.....these clowns got to go.....
Fit and Proper......they don't even know the meaning of the words.
Craftsman, wanna join up and write a book, all the people shafted by the Board could write a chapter....man I could do a fecking trilogy......Title...The Board, a story of the wild west.....cowboys and idiots........
-
hi guys,
... Fit and Proper......they don't even know the meaning of the words... Fit-us-up good and Proper. I think that is the aim, cheers
-
Been there mate, got the tee shirt.....I was fitted up right and proper....Think about how they abused their power stitching me up.....what do you think they are going to do with this crap.....
Can someone ask Maurice if he is happy about it all......he won't talk to me any more.
-
>:( Surely it would be better to do these checks when applying for an apprenticeship (current guys excluded) Imagine forking out all that money and working as a slave THEN you get told you are not good enough.
I would like to state for the record that obviously it would be much better NOT to have these checks. It's totally unnecessary. Is there any indication from the Board of how much they expect the applicant for the privilege of being judged? How much will that add to the already unrealistic fees?
-
hi guys,
... O.k. if we are to have this rule lets start at the top. The person making this judgement of `Fit and Proper` must be` Fit and Proper` themself. So who will this person be? A present board member, No, they have not been deemed to be `Fit and proper` persons, so Professional people like:-Politicians?Lawyers?Accountants?Doctors?Judges ?Financial Advisers?Real Estate Agents, we need to find someone who does not have a `Skeleton in the Cupboard` who is squeaky clean, ah but wait there is a person coming soon who may fit the bill, the Dalai Lama I think we can rely on his judgement , we can trust him, or we may have to wait until the resurrection, cheers
-
These people who act incompetent, tell us we need CPD, now they are telling us we are to be fit and proper........
Are the people who framed me fit and proper?
Are the people who have let an explosion go with no one held culpable fit and proper?
Are the people taking money off us illegally fit and proper?
Is the minister changing the law to make this illegal money taking legal fit and proper?
Is the same minister who said there was an exploding pizza hut in nelson, ignoring the real explosion that nearly killed someone fit and proper?
Are the people ignoring the advise from the OAG, Ombudsman and regulation review fit and proper?
Are the people who hide behind the guise of a charity to avoid paying tax fit and proper?
Is the person who said this below fit and proper......he is either so ill informed that he don't know what he is on about or he is lying to hide what is actually in the policy.....
So Mr Jackson if......in the info brief
This requirement affects people applying to be registered in the licensed class and will not affect tradespeople renewing their existing licences or applying to be registered in the certifying class.
Why is this hidden in the policy.........
4 Guiding principles
4.1 An applicant must satisfy the Board they are a fit and proper person to be entitled to:
a be registered under section 36 of the Act
b be issued with a practising licence under section 44 of the Act
c a renewal of their practising licence under section 51 of the Act.
I'll let you decide whether he is a liar or incompetent....either way I don't think he is fit and proper.
They need to hold the standards, that they force upon us, up to them selves and see if they are up to the standards that they pontificate about.....
They need to look in the mirror.....
-
Hi guys, I think we may have to get a `United Nations` ruling on this as this sort of regulation smacks of `Arian Race` mentality may be some Austria/German blood in the rule makers, next thing they will be wanting us to prove our religion, cheers
-
Badger - perhaps someone at the Board wants to give you a prostate check - I can hear the rubber gloves flicking as we speak...
-
Cheers Jax.....now I have bad pictures in my head, of the "lucky charms" leprechaun dressed as a doctor.... to go with the voices. Jesus its getting crowded in here.
-
Ha Robbo.....perhaps they are attempting to set up a "master" race......with stickers for your van.
-
hi guys/Badger don`t laugh you may have to pull your pants down to prove your not jewish,cheers
-
hi guys, this is a print out of relavent details of the new: `Fit and Proper Person Policy`that i will be dropping into my local plumbers mechants smoko rooms so as all plumbers can be informed, anyone on here can copy it and do the same if they so wish,cheers
-
From the policy....
However, if the Board is aware of matters that lead it to be concerned about the persons fit and proper person status
Or made aware ....... basically if they feel like it or if one of their cronies tell them, they will go you, you will be guilty until proven innocent.....you could loose your plumbing licence on a health issue.....WTF.
Your livelihood gone in a stroke of a pen.....what are you going to do then......work illegally???
Mark my words.....This will be the beginning of a witch hunt.
-
I think this probably has more to do with the training of inmates in/for chch perhaps?
Gives the board a mechanism to legally carry out checks?
dont get me wrong I wholly agree with all concerns raised...
-
hi guys/integrated, so why don`t they tell the `Corrections dept`then they can stop wasting money on the training,cheers
-
From a legal dictionary, definitions in blue.....
Fit; ......correct; reasonably sufficient. That which is well adapted or appropriate. No mention of a health check
Proper;....... is the degree of care a reasonable, prudent person would use under similar circumstances.
I am just curious how a health check and a police clearance is arrived at by these people. Please can someone let me know?
-
hi guys/integrated, so why don`t they tell the `Corrections dept`then they can stop wasting money on the training,cheers
I agree that they should - but this piss weak gubberment totally contradicts itself by saying that there needs to be harsh measures taken upon those who are not competent but then goes out of its way to train with the intention to employ those that are most likely not to be...
part of me believes that a man can serve his time and pay his debt to society and so be "rehabilitated"
...but...
I have heard many a wise man say that it was not possible to polish a turd...
-
Hey your right ''You Cant polish a turd'' But you can roll it in glitter!
-
hi guys, integrated says(I think this probably has more to do with the training of inmates in/for ch-ch perhaps) If this is true they have tried to be clever with making a rule that looks like it targets every one in the trades with the real reason being the targeting of trained ex-cons without getting in the crap with the govt,cheers
-
hi guys, integrated says (part of me believes that a man can serve his time and pay his debt to society and so be "rehabilitated")...
I don’t really have a problem with these guys I’ve worked around people who have been in jail some of who were plumbers we should have no fear of these guys, if they want to target those people then they should say so, it’s the way they set these rules up that will cast the net over anyone that they see fit to investigate over some obscure rule, that may include guys who contribute to this site or members of the Federation, cheers
-
When you have witnessed what I have, I have good reason to believe that they will use it how and when they like, on whoever they like.....could be anyone of you, whether on here or not, whether a fed member or not.
Remember why they had to stop using local guys auditing their own opposition/competition for the biannual gas audits.......
That is why it all needs to be blind and impartial.....fair and open......which in my experience it very, very rarely is....if ever.
-
I have this to say:
First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out--
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the communists
and I did not speak out--
because I was not a communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out--
because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for me--
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
-
Sent today.
Max
Please see the email below I sent 22nd June, as it is a OIA request I was under the impression that a reply was due within 20 days, please can you confirm so I can progress to the next stage of an appeal to the Ombudsman.
Please can I assure you that this is neither a frivolous nor vexatious request. I believe clarification on this is very important because it deals with the Board’s ability to grant or deny a persons ability to work and provide for his family and the grounds on which this all could be withheld.
Best Regards Paul Gee,
I am only asking for the parameters for taking someone's livelihood off them. 20 days for an OIA request?
-
Badger I think they answered you publically in the July Info Brief - they give you a whole page of information - after they have a crack about the Campbell Live programme.
-
Didn't see it until tonight. Isn't worded a bit different?
-
hi guys,More infiltration at the board!!!cheers...Chris James who is currently Quality and Standards Manager at Master Plumbers has been appointed to the position of Team Leader Registration and Licensing and will start 29 July.
-
hi guys, board news or b.s. you choose,cheers
...
In line with your feedback from the recent survey, the Board has made significant progress in recent years. The Board has already implemented the majority of the recommendations contained in the report from the Office of the Auditor General.
The Board is disappointed that again we are all subject to misleading information being used to undermine public confidence in the industry and those working in it. The Board is committed to ensuring it is providing the industry with the highest quality support and services. We are looking forward to letting you know about further developments in the coming months.
-
Yeah and did you read how they defended the trip to Aussie - it was to study the "training package". Now that would be the training package that the Armstrong Report talked about - when it said the Board had no business poking their nose into training - the Act didn't allow it as far as I understand. Mind you that's never stopped them doing what they want before. Regardless I'm sure practitioners fees should not have been spent on such a junket. Haven't they heard of phones, and email. This took place at the beginning of their "world domination" phase.
What's happened to the Board Chair? I see the Deputy Chair seems to be assuming the mantel in the newsletters. I wonder if he actually watched Campbell Live himself. I don't think anyone has condoned non qualified workers in this industry. The point he missed is that their illegal collection of fees and levies, not to mention the illegality around the CPD scheme has driven people to the stage where some have not been able to pay their fees, and others simply don't want to give it to a body they consider corrupt.
I see the licensing numbers are down 12% - do the Board think all these people have gone to Australia? I think not, they will be working in the system, not licensed and not upskilling.
How can this board carry on the way they do when the EWRB are CUTTING costs and DROPPING the cost of licensing, and INCREASING the period your licence covers. How can one regulatory body act so responsibly and the other one behave like a bunch of dopes.
Flip Flop should appoint the EWRB to oversee our industries as well as the sparkies.
Good to see that obviously some of the comments are hurting them - I hope they feel ashamed.
While I'm at it - great pic of Wal in the latest issue of Toolbox Magazine. Loving the picture and the sign he has outside his office.
-
hi guys, jax i was working with a sparkie yesterday, he was complaining about the changes and also informed me that if they apply for their licence on-line a two year licence will cost them $120. he also said that new rules say that a power point for a gas water heater is not allowed to be closer than 3mtrs from the gas bottle station, dont know how that will work,cheers
-
Electrical licence last year was $94 incl GST in total not other fees and levies for one year.
Electrical licence 2013, if you applied on line or over the phone $120 for two years, so effectively $60 per year and a saving of $34a year with no other fees and levies attached.
I presume the powerpoint issue with be around what the call hazardous zones? I will have a look at the electrical regs.
-
what percentage of gasfitters in the wellington area do you think attended the recent meeting/, maybe a down tools for a day and have nominated on call for emergencies?
-
Well the Board say there are about 1000 certifying gasfitters in NZ - and say 40 turned up in the Hutt and another 10 in Wgtn. Remember these were only organised a few days before hand with no real publicity other than one email invite. So 5% of the total number of certifying gasfitters in NZ, but I don't know what the breakdown by region is.
-
do you think they realize what a sad state of affairs things must be when groups and meetings like this become a virtual necessity?
I'm all for the dummy board - I think its a brilliant idea!
-
And would you put yourself forward Integrated because I think the Federation are calling for volunteers?
-
Yes I likely would - due consideration would have to be given of course - structure, logistics, etc