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Author Topic: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing  (Read 4869 times)

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Offline aboutgas

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Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« on: February 13, 2017, 02:33:40 PM »
Hi Guys

Did anyone read Stuff over the weekend and see the article (blatant support) for Jacinda Adern? In it she freely admits to fitting her own toilet so I have done the following

 From: Justin Will [mailto:]
Sent: Saturday, 11 February 2017 9:36 a.m.
To: Katrina Kellie; licensing; Registrar
Cc: newsdesk@nzherald.co.nz; newstips@stuff.co.nz; letters@listener.co.nz
Subject: At home with Jacinda Ardern

To Jason
Head of Complaints

Please read the article and then investigate as you have a Member of Parliament (Jacinda Arderns) freely admitting to completing restricted works under the sanitary plumbing act.

If the example is not made of this and publicised in the media what hope have you of stamping out illegal practices of every joe blogs or unlicensed tradesman.


When she's not talking politics Jacinda Ardern can be found turning her hand to plumbing.
http://i.stuff.co.nz/life-style/home-property/89238813/At-my-place-Jacinda-Arderns-1990s-brick-and-tile?cid=app-iPad

and received this reply back today

Good Morning Justin,

Thank you for your complaint to the Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers Board.

This email is to confirm that the Board has received your complaint and to advise you that someone from the Board will be in contact with you in due course to discuss your complaint further.

Your complaint has been assigned file number: L17024.

Please do not hesitate to contact me if you require further assistance or clarification.

Katrina Kellie
Complaints Officer
Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers Board
Ph 0800 743 262  |  DDI 04 495 2921 | katrina@pgdb.co.nz | www.pgdb.co.nz

 



Linkback: https://www.plumbers.nz/plumbing/1/member-of-parliment-doing-there-own-plumbing/2066/
Unless the moral improves the floggings will continue

Offline Badger

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2017, 07:46:31 PM »
Nice one mate, but they only apply the rules to those who they want to.....
You can't choose who you are.....but you are the sum of your choices.......

Offline robbo

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2017, 10:09:13 AM »
Hi guys, just thinking that if she gets off this would set a serious legal president for all DIY ers so floodgates will be open!!! Cheers

Offline Watchdog

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2017, 05:32:47 AM »
The Flood Gates are already open!!!

If she wasn't able to buy the product she wouldn't have been able to put it in but the Government doesn't have the balls to stop the sale of sanitary plumbing gasfitting or drainlaying gear to non authorised people.

Offline robbo

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2017, 09:59:54 AM »
hi guys, Watchdog..I can see that it is not practical or possible to restrict sales to certain people, if it were it would be possible to restrict sales of alcohol to alcoholics/cars to non licensed, blah,blah,blah, and the list could go on forever. DIY has always been a kiwi pastime and will never stop don't matter what the law says. Anyway the Board and master plumbers association have restricted our trades to secure more work/money for themselves and doing so has made life very difficult for qualified tradesmen. How ridiculous is it when a fully qualified man with many years experience cannot ply his/her trade without being supervised? and possibly by someone who is less experienced, I could go on but the board and its advisers have produced a headless monster that needs to be killed off, cheers

Offline Jaxcat

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2017, 08:54:07 PM »
Actually Robbo I think legislation outlined supervision - blame the politicians for that one.  In regards to fully qualified if you see the Federation's view on what fully qualified should look like the problem of supervision would disappear. 
Have you learned lessons only of those who admired you, and were tender with you, and stood aside for you?  Have you not learned great lessons from those who braced themselves against you, and disputed the passage with you?  (Walt Whitman 1819-1891)  American Poet

Offline Badger

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2017, 08:29:47 AM »
And here in lies the problem.....those effecting/lobbying the people who are making the laws wanted control of the trade/business.....enter the craftsman license....

So they implemented the..."You can't run a business with out a craftsman license"......because (and this makes me laugh a lot)...we are worried that business are going out of business, not because of bad trade practice but business short comings........if you get the license, these are the people who actually put me out of business....real caring like....

But those implementing the craftsman status......well we are going to award ourselves full craftsman licenses and impose accountancy and business law and tax rules to the craftsman qualification.......making it very hard for those who are practically minded to achieve....

What happened next was a decline in competition (so it worked short term)..... but the resulting shortage of tradesman (a long term f**** up)......BUT the short minded self serving twats forgot* to factor in.................(*forgot , see couldn't care less, their pockets are full)

That with great power comes great responsibility.....and liability and fines etc.....

So now the business owners want people to work for them with the craftsman license....because, as with my case, you can royally screwed if anything happens....and you're in the craftsman/responsibility seat.....taking full responsibility for a multitude of people of varying levels of skill, or the lack there of.....

So now we are entering the stage of levels of supervision, to distance the CEO's from the work, al a Pyke River scenario......people are seeing that deregulation is a short term gain with massive short falls....you see Pyke River changed the game......that CEO in my opinion should do time, the poor families effected, just for trying to earn a crust is just terrible, my hart goes out to them, it is appalling they can't go get their sons, husbands brothers.......

But this has changed the game....

With ever more levels of "supervision" i.e. distancing yourself from responsibility.....added to ever decreasing numbers of craftsman level supervisors......well I can only think of one word.....

Clusterf**** springs to mind.....two giant bullet wounds in both feet.....they want all the business with none of the responsibility......to those reading this from the PGDB I ask you......with in the trades who are the worst at complying......those who think they are above the law or those who aren't as "connected".......hmmmmm, I wonder.




Well what I think will happen is they will further dumb down our industry and allow muppets to sign off for profit needs and housing shortage needs......basically to cover the work load and still fill their pockets.....



There is one easy answer.... but those driving this hearse of an industry will have to swallow their giant pride and admit they got it so very wrong......

Remove the craftsman status and make everyone responsible for their own work, overseen by well paid neutral inspectors......please before all the knowledge of the guys retiring is gone and we are left with the results of the last ten years of those in power f****ing up our industry and filling their pockets.

People who lobbied for the gas craftsman license represented those selling gas......the self servers who implemented it saw they could corner the market.....but guys your idea has resulted in a total decline in the industry, every time someone hears of an incident or poor gas performance or an explosion.....well they go electric or solar......basically anything but gas.......you're ill conceived plan isn't working.....and is going to decline, if not decline then achieve its full potential.....it is just plain bad business. Gas is an awesome energy product, but it is stored energy that not only deserves respect, but demands it.

My case could be used to sweep clean some of the dodgy bastards.....then once the tower of shite starts to crumble I can guarantee that those who fall, will never fall alone and will drag the other scum with them....

If you build on fear, back room deals and corruption you will ultimately fail......because you are made up of scared little people with no morals or backbone, who in the full light of public scrutiny will go up in a puff of smoke, like most other parasitic vampires......lurking in the dark like bogymen....


Sun light is the best disinfectant......





 

Offline robbo

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #7 on: February 20, 2017, 02:39:57 PM »
hi guys, how did the board go with the complaint against Jacinda Ardern are they doing anything? cheers 

Offline Enn

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #8 on: March 13, 2017, 02:47:49 AM »
Article in the Herald 2 days ago,

Jacinda Ardern's foray into DIY has been a flash in the pan after a Wellington plumber complained that Labour's deputy leader installed her own new toilet.

Justin Will complained to the Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers Board in February after reading a media report that Ardern replaced her own toilet at the home she shares with television personality Clarke Gayford in Point Chevalier.

The board investigated and chief executive Martin Sawyers this week told Will that Ardern had apologised for her error and the case was closed.

In some parts of Auckland, including where Ardern lives, it is illegal to install a toilet unless the work is carried out by an authorised plumber.

"Ms Ardern accepted the work she carried out was sanitary plumbing work under the [Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers] Act and that it was unlawful for her to replace the toilet pan herself," Sawyers wrote in a letter to Will.
Jacinda Ardern's foray into DIY has been a flash in the pan after a Wellington plumber complained that Labour's deputy leader installed her own new toilet.

Justin Will complained to the Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers Board in February after reading a media report that Ardern replaced her own toilet at the home she shares with television personality Clarke Gayford in Point Chevalier.

The board investigated and chief executive Martin Sawyers this week told Will that Ardern had apologised for her error and the case was closed.

In some parts of Auckland, including where Ardern lives, it is illegal to install a toilet unless the work is carried out by an authorised plumber.

"Ms Ardern accepted the work she carried out was sanitary plumbing work under the [Plumbers, Gasfitters and Drainlayers] Act and that it was unlawful for her to replace the toilet pan herself," Sawyers wrote in a letter to Will.
"Due to the work being minor and of low risk, Ms Ardern's cooperation, acknowledgement and apology, the board will not be charging Ms Ardern with an offence under the Act but instead have issued her with a warning."

Ardern told the Herald she did not realise when she bought and installed with Gayford the new toilet, to replace a broken down existing one, that they were breaking the law.

"Interestingly enough you can replace your own toilet in Wellington, but you can't replace your own toilet in parts of Auckland and I fall outside the area that you're allowed to replace your own toilet, I'm told, by about a kilometre."

The new toilet was part of a renovation the couple were undertaking late last year and Ardern mentioned it as her proudest moment, prompting the complaint on February 11.

"It wasn't vindictive. I literally didn't know."

Ardern, who was promoted to Labour's deputy leader last week, said she was happy to be investigated by the board and did not expect to be treated any differently from anybody else.

"I don't think I'm above the law."

She did not know the complainant.

__________ ends____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

So apparently the act is interpreted  differently in Wellington and some parts of Auckland?

Im sure that if it was Joe average that they would have been treated differently. Remember the Toilet seat saga? or the plumber that failed to strap a hot water cylinder?

And this woman is being groomed to lead the Labour party?

Why are our  potential and elected representives so out of touch by money and power and priviledge  that they no longer have any real connection to or with normal people that live down in the dust under the carpet underlay.

Im going to go and puke now, oh yes happy Plumbers day for the 11 march by the way.


''Never have so many been fooled by so few''
Plumbing is not a career it is a disease....

Offline Badger

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #9 on: March 13, 2017, 07:59:59 AM »

Offline Jaxcat

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2017, 09:36:46 AM »
The question here is was she treated the same as any other member of the public that did this job would have been?  I do believe the public and non licensed people should be treated differently - there should be two rules as someone trained and licensed should have a higher culpability due to the knowledge they have.  That said I believe many members of the public would probably think it was ok to swap out a toilet simply because they can walk down to the big box store and purchase one easily.  Herein lies the problem, these stores also give you plenty of information about HOW to do a job like this.

Was she treated correctly - in the big scheme of things she probably was - with the added publicity that went with it.  Perhaps she will become advocate for plumbers and the work they do, the fact that it is regulated and as such should only be carried out by licensed people.   Good on the plumber that bought it to everyone's attention.  I wonder if she put on a toilet seat because under the Act that is an accessory to a sanitary fixture  should only be installed by a licensed person as well.  Imagine the number of people breaking that law!


Offline craftsman

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2017, 10:49:44 AM »
Well I didn know     only in parts of Auckland is sanitary plumbing able to be  carried out by non qualified persons.   haha
Shows the contempt which media and the powers to be treat the trades.
No correction re the statement coming from the board..

Offline robbo

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2017, 12:19:08 PM »
hi guys, (Was she treated correctly - in the big scheme of things she probably was) I don't agree, she should have been taken to the courts where the common cry of: `let the courts decide` would have taken the rightful path and as it is against the law and carries penalties, the judge would have no option but to impose a fine and court costs as many other D.I.Y.ers have found, it has now set a president for other D.I.Y.ers to explore, cheers

Offline Enn

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2017, 02:32:37 PM »
Hey Jax,
 I agree there is no clear understanding of what you can do or not relating to the public. still ignorance is no excuse i think they say as far as legal stuff goes,That applies to licenced persons
The big problem i see here is that apparently there are places that you can install you own W'C and places that you can"t as stated and reported by the Herald.
 How does this improve public understanding of what you can and can"t  do ? and where you can do it or not more to the question.

Perhaps if I married a well known television personality (public servant) I too could do illegal plumbing! Who the hell is Clarke Gayford anyway? I don"t care to tell the truth about him or the utter mind rot television it"s just chewing gum for the eyes after all.


Offline Jaxcat

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Re: Member of Parliment doing there own plumbing
« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2017, 11:02:26 PM »
The rub is that if she was taken to court for this the costs would have been borne by practitioners - and more than likely have been substantially more than any fines received.   Bring on the Review of the 2006 Act and maybe some of this stuff can be tidied up - oh no one's heard anything about the Review - that's right because it seems to be buried somewhere in MBIE - along with a lot of other stuff, groaning under the weight no doubt of a thousand administrators and their policy analysts. 


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